I don't think he does that though. I don't know how he operates‚ but he doesn't trash things. He only picks things that he feels strongly and positively about‚ whereas other people make a career out of just trashing stuff.

I think there is a live music curse. When you're talking about transferring the energy and the feel and the vibe of what gets done live and making it work in a studio‚ it's really difficult. First of all‚ the power and the emotion of the moment can carry something‚ but if the songwriting isn't there‚ it's not going to work in the studio. And second of all‚ if you overdo it‚ if you over blow it on a recording‚ you can totally miss the mark.

We've always realized that the two things are different. We've refined the way that we look at recording in the studio and getting the most out of the creative process‚ which is a different one than playing live. It's thrilling to do something creative that works in a recording studio and use the tools of the recording studio to get your vision across. It's also immediately exhilarating to play the songs live when you do it like that. But the creative process and what goes into making success in either environment is totally different‚ which is good because we have fun working in both environments.

It's usually all of us are communicating by ESP or moving like a school of fish. You don't have to say things because the music guides you where you want to go‚ instead of someone forcing it. Like if I want to go from a ballad to "Enter Sandman‚" [laughter] that kind of thing isn't going to work. We also have these pedals that we can step on and talk to each other without the audience hearing. It's usually just so that we can hear each other when we're talking onstage‚ but was tried a couple of times‚ for someone to call an audible‚ to say‚ "Let's go into this song" or "Let's change keys‚" or whatever. And it was actually a train wreck. [laughter] Because it kind of derails the flow of what's going on‚ so we're much more organic about it.

We do it by feel a lot more than someone barking orders. In that sense‚ it's a true democracy. And a true democracy doesn't really work. [laughter] There's always got to be someone with a heavy hand to a certain extent. So it feels really good when the ensemble thing works really well‚ when true democracy works really well. Everyone gets a rush out of it‚ and that kind of thing snowballs‚ which is really good. And the audience feels it‚ which is also great. They're giving us energy when something's working for us‚ and the whole thing turns into a moment‚ and then we all have a nice cry about it. [laughter] When you feel that connected and everything is working‚ it feels great. And to a certain extent for me‚ there is absolutely nothing going through my head‚ other than occasionally like‚ Wow! This is working really well. Sounds like someone else is playing it.

You're getting played. And really it does feel like that sometimes. It's good. That means you're not forcing it. That means there's not too much artifice to it. That's the authentic thing. It's what we're chasing; real music happening‚ rather than some preprogrammed kind of thing. Which is really what our music industry is about right now---a lot of preprogrammed‚ glossy shit. So when you feel something authentic happening like that‚ it's pretty cool.

Well‚ there are shows that sometimes just feel like dogs‚ like the momentum never gets there. And maybe it's just our personal interaction onstage‚ where really the sum of the parts is great and everyone else is feeling it‚ like the audience is feeling it and maybe everybody else onstage is feeling it‚ and I'm the only one who didn't achieve total nirvana. To a certain extent you just have to say‚ OK‚ too bad that I didn't feel it the same way that you did‚ but overall I think the audience really enjoyed it. To tell you the truth‚ there are moments every night where that happens. Sometimes you feel like the music can do no wrong‚ and those are really good shows for us. But maybe the audience doesn't feel it like that. It's all open to interpretation. It's totally subjective.

And it's totally subjective. Like that show‚ if I listen to it‚ I hear issues. To tell you the truth‚ I can walk offstage and say that was a great show‚ and then I listen back to it and say‚ Oh man‚ that's horrible. So I've learned to try not to analyze things too much because it takes all the fun out of it.

All of this shit applies to anyone in their job or in school or whatever they're doing. We're lucky that we have a cool career‚ but there are downsides to everything‚ and there are also the great achievements‚ hopefully. We're just constantly striving for that. And keeping it fun and something that we want to do for the rest of our lives. It's hard to balance all that stuff. I think with this album‚ it really needed it to suit us. We needed to do it in a short amount of time‚ it needed to be creatively inspiring‚ and it needed to be easy and not something that we toiled over--because the more we toil over something‚ the less fun it gets. And in that sense‚ I think we were successful and happy with the results.

Five years ago‚ yes. In '94 or '96‚ like ten years ago‚ maybe not. But I have no way of knowing. Actually‚ I think it would have worked because I think our songwriting was always good. Maybe just the assurance to be able to go ahead and do it wasn't there. Maybe we would have doubted ourselves a little bit more. Or a lot more. [laughter] At this point‚ we've realized what our capabilities are and really‚ it's don't sweat the details so much. As long as we're doing something that's interesting and makes us happy. We've realized that hopefully someone else will see that same thing that we do.