DM: And ironically‚ it was their death in a way.
MM: (laughter) Yeah‚ part of a lot things that happen with time.
DM: That's pretty much a done deal. The jam band world doesn't leave a lot of room for recovery. People are so baked‚ they forget if you're not in their face all the time.
MM: (laughter) Right.
DM: I think it's that core of the jam band world that is very prejudiced‚ in some ways. I think it always has been‚ and I want to try to speak outside from being in a band. Even myself‚ I remember being a kid into The Dead and hating so much; I rejected a lot of other stuff. I liked a lot of stuff‚ but I remember being snobby.
MM: Sure‚ yeah.
DM: Maybe that's good‚ maybe that's bad‚ but…
MM: It's so funny you say that because my college roommate talked about that all the time‚ how he thought by us being into that at the time-the Dead‚ Phish‚ you guys and all of this stuff-how we were pretentious looking back on it‚ we were the pretentious music fans.
DM: It's true. It's a pretentious thing‚ I think.
MM: Yeah‚ but then‚ I was looking back and I was like‚ well‚ God‚ but I learned so much listening to that music. When I was young‚ maybe I was a little dumb about it but…
DM: I think that is what happens. It is an all-encompassing thing. Say you're 19. You might just limit yourself. I don't know. Maybe not. Maybe I'm talking out of my ass.
MM: No‚ I think you're right. I remember people I hung out with‚ it became their thing. It was part of their personality or their social groups.
DM: I guess that's it. The jam band world encompasses more than just the music. Whereas I think other genres encompass other avenues of creativity more so. I think what was the alternative world in the '80s encompassed-filmmaking and writing and photography and painting. The whole art school‚ rock band kind of thing. I don't think that was part of the jam band world. I don't think people in the jam band world looked outside of it as much‚ like as fans for other influences. It's like "I've got the Dead and I don't need anything else."
MM: Sure‚ like there was enough here with just that journey in the music.
DM: Yeah‚ all your needs were satisfied by the one scene. It was a very closed system possibly. You had art work. You had culture. You had food. I guess that that's it. It was a very highly developed culture. I don't think there was a culture like that‚ that surrounded REM (laughter).
MM: Right. It's hard though-all of those bands throw a lot of fucking information at you. Maybe it ties into that idea of not going outside of that as much because if you got really into it there was so much information.
DM: Trying to sort through it all could take a lifetime.
MM: That's kind of how it was. So I could understand. I always bring up the story of listening to Miles Davis‚ On the Corner‚ and being like‚ "I don't think if I didn't listen to the Dead and Phish so seriously‚ that I would ever get this."
DM: It's true it is a door opener. I think that was Zappa. Zappa was the bridge from the Dead to the other world. A lot of people who liked the Dead liked Zappa. In fact‚ I was at a Dead show in Alpine Valley in '89 and they played Joe's Garage in between sets. (laughter) It was like‚ "This is even more amazing than the show‚" hearing Joe's Garage pipe through the P.A. But yeah‚ it is a jumping off point. I think it's more open now than it was maybe when I was a kid. I don't know if I would print out any of this part of the interview here. I think I'm musing more than I am giving out viable information. (laughter) I don't want to be portrayed as some sort of Negative Nancy.
MM: No. But‚ hey‚ it's a very relevant topic. The way I look at it now is‚ it's just good music. Everyone should be listening to them.
DM: I think your magazine does a pretty good job of exploring other things. I don't look at it and say‚ "It's just a jam band rag." There's a lot of interesting things that are outside of that.
MM: Well‚ that's what I say. I say there is a lot of negative bullshit that gets associated with that whole world‚ and then if you look at the good side of it‚ it's what I was talking about. All of the influences are there‚ and if you set out to do what a lot of the bands themselves are doing‚ it teaches you to listen and to be open to check different shit out.